Was America founded as a Christian nation?

[Josh]

Some say America was founded as a Christian nation, pointing to references among the Founding Fathers and in their documents to prayer, God, Providence, etc.. as evidence.

However, very few of the founding fathers held belief systems which we today would probably call "Christian". Rather, most of them held to forms of "Deism" which emphasized a deity who created the world, who set the wheels in spin, so to speak, who endowed creation with certain "rights" and "values" but who didn't actually show up in real time history as the great monotheistic religions have always claimed.

Deists tended to deny the overtly supernatural. Thomas Jefferson went so far as to re-write the gospels sans miracles.
Thomas Paine ridiculed the "revealed religions" of Moses and the Christians.

I would say that America was at it's inception a nation heavily influenced by Christianity due to the fact of both it's Puritan history, the Great Awakenings, and the large percentage of everday Christian folk who made up the population.

But, one could argue that the influence of more historic or orthodox Christianity actually increased later in the 1800s.

Anyway, all this leads me to doubt the idealistic claims some Christians make about our "golden Christian past".

Actually, I think in some ways Christianity is more healthy today in America than it's ever been.

[Kirby]

While Christian religion may have had an influence on the founding fathers, (or at the very least, Judeo-Christian ethics) it is clear that they believed themselves that the country was not founded on the Christian faith.
One must only read The Treaty of Tripoli, the first sentence of Article 11, which was ratified by congress and signed by President John Adams in 1797:

As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion

Many members of that congress would be considered "founding fathers."

To be fair, the point of the Treaty of Tripoli was commercial, basically to secure the safe passage of certain goods the US was interested in. The Treaty was in no way intended to act as an official stance on religion. The fact that the writers would choose to include this statement for these purposes, though, shows what message the young US wanted to communicate to the world: We are a soverign, secular nation, ready to do business. We will not discriminate when it comes to religion while conducting trade.

For more info, here is the Wikipedia article onTreaty of Tripoli

[yeshuafreak]

The founding fathers focused more on astrology and esotericism than christianity. they were all deists and were more eclectic than traditional.

most of them joined orgainizations like the masons and rosicrucians and other secret societies that taught things according to much of the ancient greek and roman mystery religions.

i dont think that america was founded a christian nation.

shalom

[rbbailey]

I think it is interesting how much they respected and acted to protect religion, even as you all have pointed out that most of them were not "Christian" in the first place. There is no doubt that they thought highly of the Judeo-Christian belief system, and that they based their theories on how and why a government should be run on those religious systems.

But no, not a Christian nation. In fact, I think the idea that we were founded as a Christian nation has gone a long way towards hurting the reputation of Christians in this nation.

I have had to, three or four times, explain to my non-Christian friends that most thinking Christians do not believe this. And I have also had to explain that Republicans are not out to create a theocracy in America. Several of my friends are actually quite frightened of this happening. I try to explain that a thinking Christian would not want a theocracy, that in fact, the idea of a theocracy goes against what Christ came here for.

I believe God will, some day, set up HIS kingdom here on earth, but that is quite different than some crazy idea that Bush and the Neo-Cons want to turn the nation over to a religiously controlled system of laws.

[Josh]

yes... and also... yes

(agreed)

[yeshuafreak]

There is no doubt that they thought highly of the Judeo-Christian belief system, and that they based their theories on how and why a government should be run on those religious systems.

Yes. I am glad that you pointed that out- though they were not christian, they thought highly of all religion when used properly.

They also based their laws off of the Jewish codes (eye for an eye and tooth for a tooth MAX, though a MIN is a money fine).

I also agree that the notion that america was founded a christian nation affected attitudes towards christians negatively., as rbbaily said (who, i must say, posts very thoughtful posts).

I think we all agree here.

Shalom- john

[Margot]

....we all agree except for the COUNTLESS Christians I am constantly reading about who INSIST we were founded as a Christian Nation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks so much for fleshing this out, everyone. Way back when when I was in school, long before I became a Christian, I was always taught that the Founding Fathers were Deists. Suddenly, somewhere around the 80's (Mr. Reagan's Reign?) I start hearing this "lets get back to our Christian roots," thing. Where did this come from? Any ideas??

[Josh]

I remember it being popularized by a guy named Peter Marshall, whose lecture I once attended during which I was singled out publicly to remove my hat as it was disrespectful.

[yeshuafreak]

wow. to josh's comment.

shalom

[ryan]

This is a classic case of where I wish that I was more verbose in my responses, because I know that I won't do this justice.

America was not established to be a "theocracy". I have chuckled the past several years as people feared out loud that "W" would turn the country into a Theocracy. However, to undersell the religious past of this country is equally offensive.

While many of the founders were deists most asserted and reasserted the value of teaching Judeo-Christian values in the schools (even public schools). Jefferson may have re-edited his version of the Bible, but he called himself a "Christian". John Adams blasted Thomas Paine as a "blackguard" in referencing the latter's lack of faith.

Many historians balk at the US's Christian past by referencing the use of the term "Providence" instead of God or Jesus. However, further reading of those that used this word routinely recommend prayer and Bible reading.

The founders didn't want to set up a "Christian" nation because they found this a little too restrictive of personal religious beliefs (differences between the differing Christian denominations). They decided that the states should have the right to determine the official religion for themselves. Some maintained an official Christian denomination for a couple of years before jettisoning it.

Usually the argument that the US was never intended to be a Christian nation is given by people that are afraid that the US will become a theocracy. That was never the founder's intent.