ben
Advanced Member
Posts: 115
|
Post by ben on Nov 9, 2009 21:34:49 GMT -8
It's the worship of the god Molech all over again.
|
|
|
|
Post by Margot on Nov 10, 2009 22:07:42 GMT -8
Kirbstomp...
Payne's stuff is amazing as far as I'm concerned. She explains a lot of stuff that happens in the families of the school where I work. How did you become a fan? Josh! Definitely a follow up for the kids you work with!
|
|
|
|
Post by Margot on Nov 10, 2009 22:33:04 GMT -8
I anyone has not seen this video, please take the time and watch it. Keep in mind, planned parenthood receives millions of tax payer dollars thanks to liberal politicians. I watched this video. What I find amazing is that her description of what she saw on the ultrasound is almost a word-for-word account of how abortions were described to us when I was in high school. That was (gasp) in the early 70's. I grew up in the (decidedly liberal) San Francisco Bay Area in a (decidedly liberal) school system. Yet, I clearly remember the teacher talking about how the fetus would flinch when approached by the surgical instruments. Wonder how that teacher got away with such a literal explanation and I am amazed at how that lesson has changed through the years. Also interesting to me is that, when I first heard that, I wasn't a Christian and although I thought it was kind of sad, I wasn't really affected one way or another. It seemed like the people doing this were far from me and as long as I didn't do it, everything would be okay. In contrast, my own children can barely stomach hearing anything like this, which only reaffirms my belief that abortion is much more about spiritual understanding than physical understanding. I believe it is only in having God's spirit can you truly see why this is so wrong. Years ago I had the opportunity to lead a girls h.s. bible study and we started talking about abortion. Most of the girls there professed a real relationship with God, yet when we started talking about it, those same girls said they believed women should have a right to choose what to do with their bodies. So, I told them a little story about having a dog....See, you own this beautiful dog, and then you find out she's pregnant. Of course you know you'd never be able to afford to feed and raise a litter of puppies, and you know you'd probably get yelled at by your parents when they find out the puppies are coming, so, you do the only reasonable thing. When no one is home, you pop the dog up on the dining room table, take a kitchen knife, make a slice on her abdomen, pull out the puppies, throw them in the trash and sew her up before anyone finds out. Problem solved, right? You should have heard the girls scream. Some of them started yelling at me about how I could be so disgusting. These were puppies for gosh sakes! A few of them started to wretch. When I explained that that, in essence, is an abortion, you should have seen the look on their faces. I think that for the first time, everyone of them "really got it." |
|
|
|
Post by robin on Nov 10, 2009 23:02:39 GMT -8
While we are living in fantasy land. Oh, Oh, I know how to eliminate all abortions. Lets just magically make it so only married economically stable couples who want to have kids have sex. Thats it, NO ONE ELSE ALLOWED. I AM LOOKING AT YOU POOR COUPLE WHO CANNOT AFFORD KIDS AND DOESN'T HAVE HEALTH INSURANCE TO PAY FOR DELIVERY! I'm a little confused by Kevin's statement here. Are you saying that a poor economic status is a legitimate reason to kill a child? What if a couple decides to give birth to a child only to find out later that money is tight, and it would be cheaper to simply kill the child rather than deal with the burden of raising the child they chose to create. Would you then make the same excuse, or would you suggest they explore less lethal methods of dealing with they money woes? Perhaps adoption, or seeking help from family, or those within the Christian community would be offered up as a better alternative to abortion. I have good reason to believe that there are Christian organizations that off financial help to poor women who are considering abortions. |
|
|
|
Post by Josh on Nov 11, 2009 10:12:55 GMT -8
An interesting poll I read in Christianity today.
Americans who said abortion should be illegal in all/most cases:
in 2007/2008: 40%
in 2009: 44%
Amercians who said abortion should be legal in all/most cases:
in 2007/2008: 54%
in 2009: 47%
|
|
|
|
Post by robin on Nov 11, 2009 19:04:38 GMT -8
Certainly good news for unborn children everywhere. Now if we could only convince a majority of legislators, and Supreme Court Justices
|
|
|
|
Post by rbbailey on Nov 28, 2009 22:39:29 GMT -8
I think it is a travesty that most people view abortion as one of those sins that, if perpetrated, means you cannot attend church or be a Christian. The church needs to put that out front in every abortion discussion.
In my circles of non-Christian friends, the issue of abortion "rights" is pretty much the most divisive topic there is -- even more than GWB wants your babies to be Christian Warriors in Iraq so he can avenge the almost-killing of his dad.
Perhaps the worst lie that has been sold to the American public is the idea that Abortion is a Right. Making it a right means it has, "Untouchable" status. Being against abortion is very close to having a KKK tattoo on your forehead because it has been sold and bought as a "right".
(I think it is interesting that the people who argue for abortion as a privacy issue: The government cannot tell me what to do with my body. Are many of the same people who want socialized medicine... irony. But that's a different thread.)
I also think it's ironic that most abortion providers and supporters want to, "Reduce the number of abortions." Why? If it's a right, why would you want to infringe upon a right?
Abortion is a privilege. A human right cannot be a human right for only one half of the population -- women only.
I could go on... and on...
|
|
|
|
Post by Josh on Nov 29, 2009 9:02:17 GMT -8
Really??? I don't think I know ONE Christian who would believe that. What kind of Christians are you hanging out with???  |
|
|
|
Post by rbbailey on Nov 29, 2009 10:50:12 GMT -8
No, my bad, I mean people who are not in the church think Christians are like that. I think one of the main reasons is that Christians tend to get real worked up over abortion -- as they should -- but we forget to place the priority on grace and forgiveness before discussing the politics and legal issues.
Then we have these wackos who go and kill an abortionist because they believe they are doing, "the will of the LORD!" That's the press that gets out there -- not Pregnancy Resources Centers.
|
|
|
|
Post by Margot on Nov 29, 2009 12:37:33 GMT -8
I think it is a travesty that most people view abortion as one of those sins that, if perpetrated, means you cannot attend church or be a Christian. The church needs to put that out front in every abortion discussion. agreed! Perhaps the worst lie that has been sold to the American public is the idea that Abortion is a Right. Making it a right means it has, "Untouchable" status. Being against abortion is very close to having a KKK tattoo on your forehead because it has been sold and bought as a "right". I have heard many others say this before, and I would agree. Whoever got that idea changed the dynamic completely and set up a situation for all out warfare. (I think I have a pretty good idea of who put that idea in someone's head...) |
|
|
|
Post by Josh on Nov 29, 2009 17:57:40 GMT -8
Screwtape or Wormwood?  Which one? |
|
|
|
Post by rbbailey on Nov 29, 2009 21:13:29 GMT -8
Both.
(Did you see my post on the last page, Josh?)
|
|
|
|
Post by Josh on Nov 29, 2009 21:34:46 GMT -8
Yes. Thanks for the clarification. And, unfortunately, I think it is an astute one.
(it's not unfortunate that you're astute, just that I think there are probably a lot of folks who aren't Christians who think they wouldn't be welcome in the Church if they've had an abortion)
|
|
|
|
Post by krhagan19 on Jan 2, 2010 20:44:29 GMT -8
I think that there is a fundamental disconnect in the politics of abortion coming from a horrible misunderstanding of basic biology. The human beings in the womb development is on a spectrum. Things develop over time, the supreme courts arbitrary decision in Roe V Wade ignores the biological fact that the difference between a Zygote and an infant is a matter of degree not a matter of objective difference. As a result I feel that the majority of "pro choice" advocates who argue in favor of "individual rights" I am speaking both of libertarians and democrats, they do not recognize any rights of the baby to be born. If you ignore that a zygote human then it seems clear that the right of a mother to control her own body must be dominant, yet if you admit that a zygote is human, it follows that it has rights of its own, and its right to exist supersedes rights of convenience for the mother to be.
|
|
|
|
Post by carebear on Apr 8, 2010 11:45:37 GMT -8
Don't know if I'll be quoting everyone from the Universal Health Care thread correctly, but here it is:
|
|
|
|
Post by carebear on Apr 8, 2010 11:55:34 GMT -8
Moritz wrote: Moritz wrote: So can I please choose to slay my 4 year old because my boyfriend doesn’t want him anymore and I need to go back to school and I just don’t have time for him. I have the right to choose. Also, you CANNOT call this murder AND say it’s a “fact” because that is just your “angle”. I see this act as something necessary for me and my freedom so I choose to suction my 4 year old into bloody pieces. That is not in fact murder….it is freedom. When I deliberately stop my son’s heart from beating, even when he is healthy and growing, I am not committing murder…..let me keep my blind glasses on. (note: If you want to play the card that a fetus is not a human, can you explain to me scientifically what a heartbeat means? And then tell me that science hasn't proven over and over again that a fetus has a heartbeat around 5 weeks......and then tell me that all the statistics are wrong that show the majority of abortions are performed after the heartbeat has started beating) If you don't think it's human, what do you think the thing is with a heartbeat? A frog? Come on! It's human and thus it's murder (whether they know it or not!....most of them know it but deny it and say it's not a human) So, now if you've answered all my questions in the last few paragraphs, can you please allow me to terminate the heartbeat in my 4 year old (and my 5 week gestation fetus) because they are inconveniences? You can't call it murder AND say that's fact.  |
|
|
|
Post by robin on Apr 8, 2010 13:27:35 GMT -8
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams, 'Argument in Defense of the Soldiers in the Boston Massacre Trials,' December 1770
US diplomat & politician (1735 - 1826)
|
|
Which one?