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Post by Josh on Oct 20, 2011 14:01:56 GMT -8
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Post by Kirby on Oct 20, 2011 15:09:03 GMT -8
Or it could mean that our justice system does not adequately prevent crime or reform criminals? I wonder how many of that 25% are repeat offenders? I know the population is disproportional in regards to color.
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Post by robin on Oct 21, 2011 14:17:30 GMT -8
This may very well be a result of our failed "war on drugs". There are far too many people in prison for Marijuana and other drug related crimes. Also, union representing prison guards have lobbied for stiffer penalties on minor crimes. For example the unions pushed hard for California's "three strikes your out" law. This law has mandatory minimum sentences for repeat offenders, even when the offenders are involved in minor crimes like drug possession.
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Post by rbbailey on Oct 23, 2011 18:47:11 GMT -8
Kirby, is the prison system supposed to reform?
Maybe it isn't harsh enough to make people think twice about going back there. Or maybe the issue isn't the court system, or the prison system at all.
I've seen several places where the statistic of 1/3 of our prisoners are illegal aliens. Why should we keep them in prison? Why shouldn't we simply deport them?
Robin, I agree, in a way. Possession of drugs should not be a felon, it should result in confiscation and a fine. Only people who are selling or distributing or making drugs should be put into prison for it.
There are a lot of reasons lobbyists should be thrown in prison, this is one of them.
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Post by Josh on Oct 24, 2011 19:47:24 GMT -8
Seems more likely that this is due to socio-economic factors working against minorities than merely racism in the legal/ law enforcement system.
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Post by rbbailey on Oct 24, 2011 20:04:56 GMT -8
I think that's true, but I also wonder about the black kids who get harsh sentences for light crimes when we all know how the white kid from Lake Oswego would be treated. Socio-economic issues sometimes are race issues.
Not always, and I would never say that is an excuse or even an explanation -- it's more about the culture that the different races have been raised with, rather than the biology of skin color.
Anyway, I think prison should be prison. Reform should be for reform. If a criminal is reformed due to fear of prison, that's two birds with one stone.
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Post by Kirby on Oct 24, 2011 22:10:36 GMT -8
If the prison system is not meant to reform, then what is it meant for? If just punishment, It would seem capital punishment to be more logical. There has to be some reformation effort there, ethically, no? The problem? There is profit to be made in prisons. www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2010/08/private_prisonsAgreed.
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Post by Kirby on Oct 24, 2011 22:12:11 GMT -8
By the way, remind me why marijuana is still illegal?
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Post by stevekimes on Oct 26, 2011 10:16:57 GMT -8
To respond to your original question, Josh, I think we'd have to answer in the affirmative that our nation is a more just nation than any other if our high prison rate was a result of our justice. However, I don't think any of us would say that is true. Are we more just than Canada, or Sweden? More just than Singapore or Thailand? Are we even less corrupt?
Or is it, perhaps, that we are a nation that judges more than other nations? I don't know, but I think that this possibility is as least as likely as we being a country that is more just than any other nation.
Also, we would have to determine that putting offenders in prison is the most just system. Certainly it has been proven that the longer someone is incarcerated the more likely they will be to offend again. What does prison actually communicate to prisoners? How is it a part of a just society?
The post I put on FB was only there to raise questions, not to provide answers. But I see it as an indication of a serious social problem, just as 1% of our population being homeless every year is an indication of a serious social problem. The question is: what are some solutions?
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