Mark 9:14-10:52

[Josh]

Post your comments, questions, and discussion starters on Mark 9:14-10:52 as replies to this post.

[Josh]

Wow, there's a lot in this passage, which makes it super difficult to teach on. So many little vignettes into the life and teaching of Jesus.

I'm just going to pick a select few to focus on this Sunday, but there's so much great stuff here I think it'd be great if we could discuss some of it further here.

For instance, I don't think I'm going to go into the healing story in 9:14-32, but one of my favorite responses ever to Jesus is, "Lord, I believe, help my unbelief". I can so relate.

Also, the reason for the initial failure to heal the boy is a bit unclear. Is it the disciples or the father's lack of faith, or their method? If you put it all together, it seems like a combo of all three.

A couple questions: why does Jesus call the evil spirit a "deaf and mute" spirit? Is it because it refused to speak it's name, perhaps?

I also love how when Jesus tells them again that He is going to die, they are afraid to ask Him about it. Who wouldn't be after that "get behind me, satan?" incident

[carebear]

why does Jesus call the evil spirit a "deaf and mute" spirit? Is it because it refused to speak it's name, perhaps?

In verse 17 of chapter 9 the father explains that the spirit will not let the boy speak....giving that spirit a "name"....a deaf and dumb spirit. In verse 25 Jesus said the spirit would not let the boy speak or hear. It caused the boy to be mute or dumb and deaf. Jesus called it a deaf and dumb spirit because that was what the spirit was doing to people.

Verse 20 talks about how when the spirit saw Jesus it started thrashing the boy around. This reminded me of the recent situation of the woman who received deliverance from satanic possession in Illinois. When she looked into the minister's eyes, she saw light but the demons forced her head to physically move away from the minister's eyes, causing her to thrash her head.

[carebear]

In verse 29 of chapter 9, Jesus says this kind of spirit can only be cast out by prayer (and fasting some versions say).

Here is a video of a story of a man being healed of blindness in Mozambique. Heidi Baker is someone who I think lives a life of prayer and fasting and this may be one reason she sees these kinds of miracles happen.



Also, I ran across this man from a youtube video from CBN and I like what he has to say about the Kingdom of God and all that. The only bummer is the sound is not in sync with the video so you have to just listen...haha:



Healings with a group of teenagers on the beach....awesome!

[michelle]

So I think I found my new favorite verse today.

Mark 10:35 Then James and John, the sons of Zebedee, came to him. "Teacher," they said, "we want you to do for us whatever we ask." When we read this aloud in church I laughed because I've been there. Trying to tell God, "So you are going to do this my way." Oh boy!!

[Josh]

I hear that out loud laugh ;D

Mark 9:35-37
Jesus called the Twelve and said, "If anyone wants to be first, he must be the very last, and the servant of all."

He took a little child and had him stand among them. Taking him in his arms, he said to them,"Whoever welcomes one of these little children in my name welcomes me; and whoever welcomes me does not welcome me but the one who sent me."

Some good quotes on this passage:

Augustine: “Observe a tree, how it first tends downwards, that it may then shoot forth upwards. It fastens its roots low in the ground, that it may send forth its top towards heaven. Is it not from humility that it endeavors to rise? But without humility it will not attain to higher things. You are wanting to grow up into the air without a root. Such is not growth, but a collapse.”

Karl Barth: “To think of every human being, even the oddest, most villainous or miserable as one to whom Jesus Christ is Brother and God is Father...”

Gregory of Nyssa: “Let each remind himself that he is not only subordinate to the brother at his side, but to all. If he knows this, he will truly be a disciple of Christ”.

[Josh]

Carrie,

I watched the Todd White interview clip. Interesting guy, so a couple of my honest personal observations: on the one hand he seems genuine, his rationale has force, on the other I am troubled about his association with Benny Hinn*, but that's probably another thread in and of itself.

I thought it was interesting that he said he prayed unsuccessfully for healing for a very long time before he had a genuine experience. One comment He made that I disagreed with was when he said if a healing isn't taking place, then his conclusion was that something must be wrong with his faith.

The videos are interesting.. The respondants seemed genuine. I would love to see some follow up with the doctor of the kid with the broken arm, for instance. From a skeptics angle, not being there or experiencing it, it is still possible to see these examples as the power of suggestion and the ability to "read people".

[carebear]

On the one hand he seems genuine, his rationale has force, on the other I am troubled about his association with Benny Hinn*, but that's probably another thread in and of itself.

Today in church we spoke about the disciples telling Jesus that they should have stopped a man who cast out a devil in Jesus’ name because the man wasn’t one of them. Todd White seems to be like the man the disciples were worried about. I think we too cannot believe men like Benny Hinn and Todd White are not working for the kingdom of God just because they act different than we do (or maybe don’t know certain things) because they are still seeing healings in Jesus’ name.

“I thought it was interesting that he said he prayed unsuccessfully for healing for a very long time before he had a genuine experience. One comment He made that I disagreed with was when he said if a healing isn't taking place, then his conclusion was that something must be wrong with his faith.”

Todd was referring to the faith to heal because he knew the Bible said that signs and wonders follow them who believe so he knew something was lacking in his faith to heal. I know my faith is lacking in that area. What should we do to help that? Look and learn from people who are seeing signs and wonders in Jesus’ name or should we just dream about it?

“The videos are interesting. The respondants seemed genuine. I would love to see some follow up with the doctor of the kid with the broken arm, for instance. From a skeptics angle, not being there or experiencing it, it is still possible to see these examples as the power of suggestion and the ability to "read people".”

I will email Todd and see if he will help us out with any doctor's reports.

I believe anyone can work healings in Jesus’ name just as we discussed in church today (we mentioned in church that the man the disciples were wanting to stop might have only known ‘two bits’ about Jesus but as long as he knew Jesus healed, he could do it). I need to ask myself what’s the difference here?

[Josh]

Today in church we spoke about the disciples telling Jesus that they should have stopped a man who cast out a devil in Jesus’ name because the man wasn’t one of them. Todd White seems to be like the man the disciples were worried about. I think we too cannot believe men like Benny Hinn and Todd White are not working for the kingdom of God just because they act different than we do (or maybe don’t know certain things) because they are still seeing healings in Jesus’ name.

I knew this was going to relate back to that teaching

OK, but, hear me out.

It all hinges on whether Benny Hinn is a false teacher or not. We are told to avoid and repudiate false teachers.

The passage in Mark is about someone performing exorcisms who is not one of the disciples, or known to Jesus, not about someone who is a false teacher. There were false teachers in Acts who were said to work miracles as well, but the disciples had nothing to do with them (such as Simon the Sorceror).

Last time I did some investigation of Benny Hinn I concluded that he was a false teacher- I'm willing to open up the investigation again. Some people teach false doctrine accidentally, I'm willing to admit that, but not Benny. He has had plenty of time to correct his statements, he's a learned man in the public eye, etc...

It's not at all that "he acts differently" that I am concerned about him; it's his theology.

[Josh]

I started a separate Benny Hinn thread here:

aletheia.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=personalities&thread=2848

since I know that's a much larger topic.

[carebear]

Please remind me why it all hinges on Benny hinn? Does it mean that everyone who believes Benny Hinn is a true believer cannot perform miracles? Also what exactly is so wrong with his theology? Or how is he compared to Simon the sorcerer?

Do you think as a church we are in a "dark ages" in terms of belief and faith in healing, and we are all kind of almost afraid of trying?

It seems to me that healing people in the name of Jesus is one of the greatest tools of evangelism and it was one of the 1st century's greatest tools of evangelism as well.

Either way the miraculous should follow Christians way more than it does right now, I believe. I’m guilty as charged.

In John 9:3 Jesus said, “"Neither this man nor his parents sinned, but this happened so that the work of God might be displayed in his life.” Maybe the norm is for us to do the same thing….heal people in Jesus’ name so they will see the glory of God and be saved. It seems to me that the people who see healings in Jesus’ name are also very in touch with and yielded to the Holy Spirit…..I want to learn more about that. I don’t think it’s prideful to have signs and wonders following you.

[Josh]

I'll respond to all of this on the other thread.