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Post by atheist jon on Jul 8, 2012 11:11:29 GMT -8
Another thread (Are some jobs not okay for Christians?) implies that Christians have a higher moral standard than non-believers, which is demonstrably untrue and rather offensive. But not surprising. I don't believe there are any circumstances in which anyone should be executed for any reason whatsoever. It's moral and right to protect the population from bad people but it is immoral to kill them.
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Post by Josh on Jul 8, 2012 14:55:38 GMT -8
Jon,
I think this deserves it's own thread.
So, a question for you. Why do you think:
?
What is your basis for asserting that one is moral and the other is immoral?
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Post by atheist jon on Jul 8, 2012 21:14:18 GMT -8
Good question. I guess it is just common sense and prudent to protect society from those that would do it harm. I don't think it is even a question of morality.
However, killing someone, whether it has been state sanctioned or not, is a different matter. It is not our place to take away someones life when they have already been rendered no longer a danger to anyone. Killing someone in self defence is another issue, obviously.
And to save your discomfort, I won't even touch on the fact that many innocent or mentally ill people have been put to death under such barbarous conditions.
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Post by atheist jon on Jul 8, 2012 21:26:51 GMT -8
I would also like to use this opportunity to take issue with a rather odious phrase used on more than one occasion by someone at work. "He is a good Christian man." What the hell is that supposed to mean? Are there not good Hindi men? Good Muslims? Good Jains? Good atheists?
Good grief.
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Post by Josh on Jul 9, 2012 0:42:45 GMT -8
Good question. I guess it is just common sense and prudent to protect society from those that would do it harm. I don't think it is even a question of morality. However, killing someone, whether it has been state sanctioned or not, is a different matter. It is not our place to take away someones life when they have already been rendered no longer a danger to anyone. So, to the first you appeal to common sense. I suppose you're saying that it is a pragmatic rule, if one is investing in the survival of a society, rather than a moral rule. On the second you simply re-state an unsupported premise rather than giving me a sufficient grounding for your moral stance. How do you KNOW that capital punishment is wrong? Is it always wrong? |
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Post by Josh on Jul 9, 2012 0:45:17 GMT -8
I would also like to use this opportunity to take issue with a rather odious phrase used on more than one occasion by someone at work. "He is a good Christian man." What the hell is that supposed to mean? Are there not good Hindi men? Good Muslims? Good Jains? Good atheists? Good grief. The phrase may not be used exclusively, as in "all Christians are good" or "only Christians are truly good", neither of which have Scriptural support. It may simply mean, "he's supposed/ should to be good" or "his actions are in line with his beliefs". |
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Post by stevekimes on Jul 9, 2012 8:32:48 GMT -8
That thread doesn't assume that Christians, in general, practice a higher moral standard, but it does assume that Jesus insists upon one.
Christian standards are terribly high. "Love your enemies" is a standard that goes beyond our basic natures, as is "sell your possessions and give to the poor", "forgive an offender seventy times seven" and so on. These are higher standards than non-believers because they actually work against our human nature, which demands that we take offense, keep our own property and respond to harm with harm.
The only reason that Christians can possibly hold such a standard is because we are supposed to have the Holy Spirit-- God within us-- to meet such a high standard. The fact that most Christians do not meet such a high standard would cause me to question the Holy Spirit's work in some people's lives. The fact that some people actually do meet such a standard is a proof (not THE proof, no such thing) of God's working in those people's lives.
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