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Post by Kirby on Apr 15, 2010 9:10:00 GMT -8
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Post by moritz on Apr 15, 2010 11:12:31 GMT -8
Reminds me of Feuerbach and Freud, who both argued that God was a projection of one's own desires.
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Post by carebear on Apr 15, 2010 11:35:46 GMT -8
That's why Christ followers have been given access to His Holy Spirit who communicates to them God's love, desire, etc. We must continually listen to His leading.
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Post by Kirby on Apr 15, 2010 11:49:30 GMT -8
I understand, Carrie, but the point of the article is that we believe there is a Holy Spirit because that is a projection of our desire. I do not necessarily agree with that, but it is an interesting study.
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Post by carebear on Apr 15, 2010 12:26:58 GMT -8
I understand the article is trying to get deep into "truth", but the fact of the matter is we cannot project the Holy Spirit into existence. We cannot make up His movement. Anyone who has experienced His love and power to the point that all desire for heroin and suicide vanished in an instant (for no one's gain) knows they never could have projected that into existence
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Post by moritz on Apr 15, 2010 12:27:08 GMT -8
That's why Christ followers have been given access to His Holy Spirit who communicates to them God's love, desire, etc. We must continually listen to His leading. If it really was the Holy Spirit who inspires the view of Christian's about God, I would expect Christians to be unanimous in their estimation of what God's will looks like. But Christians cover the entire spectrum. What do you make of that?
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Post by carebear on Apr 15, 2010 12:29:21 GMT -8
God's will about what?
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Post by moritz on Apr 15, 2010 12:30:09 GMT -8
Did you read the article?
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Post by carebear on Apr 15, 2010 12:40:11 GMT -8
yes, but i didn't know if you wanted to discuss one particular topic. Christians who truly listen to the Holy Spirit will have very similar convictions about God's will on issues as long as they purposefully don't let their flesh mix into the equation.
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Post by moritz on Apr 15, 2010 13:18:25 GMT -8
yes, but i didn't know if you wanted to discuss one particular topic. Christians who truly listen to the Holy Spirit will have very similar convictions about God's will on issues as long as they purposefully don't let their flesh mix into the equation. I suppose you truly listen to the holy spirit and have an applicable idea of what God's will looks like. And I have a feeling you are in agreement with God most of the time, aren't you?
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Post by carebear on Apr 15, 2010 14:06:47 GMT -8
If I walk closely with God, and cultivate a relationship with him, I believe Christ followers can hear God's voice and engage with his Spirit. God directs our paths even if we don't know everything. It's about an intimate relationship....not about knowing all the answers to everything all the time. And it's not about judgement. And it's not about projecting our desires into the world as much as we'd like to. It is about walking with God and sharing the Good News and His love and desire for humanity which He created and is the Father of.
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Post by moritz on Apr 15, 2010 14:15:28 GMT -8
If I walk closely with God, and cultivate a relationship with him, I believe Christ followers can hear God's voice and engage with his Spirit. God directs our paths even if we don't know everything. It's about an intimate relationship....not about knowing all the answers to everything all the time. And it's not about judgement. And it's not about projecting our desires into the world as much as we'd like to. It is about walking with God and sharing the Good News and His love and desire for humanity which He created and is the Father of. You didn't answer my questions. Appart from that, you and I live in two different worlds. Cheers
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Post by carebear on Apr 15, 2010 15:18:52 GMT -8
And I'm pretty sure God doesn't answer everyone in the same way, but His principles and character and love is the same for each person. Cheers
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Post by Josh on Apr 15, 2010 19:43:52 GMT -8
OK, first off, I don't really see a problem with the general conclusion of this study. That it's easier to conform God to our own likeness than to be conformed to His- is that really hard to swallow? BTW, I think there is mention of this study in an article in the most recent Christianity Today. If it really was the Holy Spirit who inspires the view of Christian's about God, I would expect Christians to be unanimous in their estimation of what God's will looks like. But Christians cover the entire spectrum. What do you make of that? This conclusion misses two major factors: 1) Does God even have a uniform, universal will on every subject? (I don't think so) 2) It doesn't account for humanity's own ability, even tendency, to mis-hear God, which Christians freely admit.
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Post by Kirby on Apr 17, 2010 14:18:48 GMT -8
I think the crux of this issue lies in belief in something that is for the most part intangible and unscientific. Images and attitudes toward God are largely subjective: they are based on our experiences and measured against our faith, intuition, other experiences, and comparisons with what others haved shared with us. This explains the large spectrum within Christianity and even within denominations. How could he? That would mean he would have to be able to be fully defined, using a human created definition so that we could understand and define. If we assume that God is eternal, omniscient, omnipresent, etc., then that becomes impossible. If we were to survey every Christian, we would find that God met them (or they met God, depending on how you want to look at it when they were experiencing indivally unique things, at individually unique times and phases in their life, and that they all are individually unique in intellectualism, personality, and morality. It would be an impossible task to fully understand every person's attiudes and individual belief about God. (And that it is not even close to the measure of eternality that we assume God exists within.) That is why we cannot put God in a neat box, with flashy advertising, because that would only represent God in our individually unique view and understanding. It follows that that individuality is influenced uniquely via nature and nurture, and that would certainly alter our beleifs, attitudes, openness to truth and falsehoods, and ultimately our faith.
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